// v.02
#activityPubescens
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@Friendica Support
Hi there,
for a while now I'm wondering about the ever lasting discussion and every once in a while upcoming request that friendica should have a poll option.
To begin with I do consider that it is not only reasonable but even mandatory to have more than one profile in a decentralized system. There for, having besides a friendica account a mastodon account, sounds quite logical. So as mastodon does have poll's, such a general setup of profiles solves the main problem/issue/request.
Than there is the fact that friendica, by having like and dislike in posts and answers., basically a poll option does exist, it only has to be discovered and integrated to the cultural use of this platform.
So, by having two opposing choices like yes/no -> like/dislike we can do pools with three expressions:
- yes
- no
- yes+no
If a poll is designed and published immediately with answers for every alternative option/question we would have a poll feature by design if the poll is published in the right manner.
If you agree to this consideration, please vote "like"
If you don't agree please vote "dislike"
If you are not sure that you got the idea please select "like" and "dislike"
If you you don't care about pool's just be brilliantly absent from the ballot box.
Ballot count since v.01 of this post:
Two hundred eighty seven friendicans abstained from the vote because they don't have a Badekapp for the pool option, no votes in favor of poll's and one vote against poll's by the user @Wilhelm
v.01
// v.01@Friendica Support
Hi there,
for a while now I'm wondering about the ever lasting discussion and every once in a while upcoming request that friendica should have a pool option.
To begin with I do consider that it is not only reasonable but even mandatory to have more than one profile in a decentralized system. There for, having besides a friendica account a mastodon account, sounds quite logical. So as mastodon does have pool's, such a general setup of profiles solves the main problem/issue/request.
Than there is the fact that friendica, by having like and dislike in posts and answers., basically a poll option does exist, it only has to be discovered and integrated to the cultural use of this platform.
So, by having two opposing choices like yes/no -> like/dislike we can do pools with three expressions:
[ul]
[*]yes
[*]no
[*]yes+no
[/ul]If a pool is designed and published immediately with answers for every alternative option/question we would have a pool feature by design if the pool is published in the right manner.
If you agree to this consideration, please vote "like"
If you don't agree please vote "dislike"
If you are not sure that you got the idea please select "like" and "dislike"
utopiArte
in reply to utopiArte • — (tupambaé) •This proposal implies that the profiles vote by name.
While this is in some democratic events common, for example in parliaments there do exist the option of a secrete or public vote, what is your opinion about creating such public votes?
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jesuiSatire …ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ
in reply to utopiArte • • •#fediTips
Hi there @utopiarte,
I'm observing this #poll question on the #friendica @helpers #group from over here on a #mastodon instance and can't like, only fav, yet actually I'd like to be against this proposal as it is very dangerous!
I wouldn't put my name on the line in this internet for poll's by name vote, #democracy or even post an opinion.
That's way to dangerous in the actually #zeitGeist of #neoLiberalFascist's having the thumb on LLM's to hunt us down.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxNZduzm6B8
Grüss mir die Genossen
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utopiArte
in reply to jesuiSatire …ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ • •jesuiSatire …ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ wrote:
Why than do you lecture us, actually wasting our time, with your #satireSplaining @jesuiSatire …ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ ?
🤔
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utopiArte
in reply to utopiArte • — (tupambaé) •Initial post wrote:
utopiArte doesn't like this.
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utopiArte
in reply to utopiArte • — (tupambaé) •Friendica Support reshared this.
mʕ•ﻌ•ʔm bitPickup
in reply to utopiArte • • •#boostRequest
#poll #multipleChoicePoll
Do you have more than one profile in the fediverse?
@helpers
@utopiarte
- Yes (52%, 32 votes)
- No (41%, 25 votes)
- What do you mean, only two? (9%, 6 votes)
- I use real name and face and am on mastodon.social (3%, 2 votes)
61 voters. Poll end: 1 month agoreshared this
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Medea Vanamonde🏳️⚧️ ♀
in reply to mʕ•ﻌ•ʔm bitPickup • • •Always have a back up iteration.
Comes in handy when an Admin goes Ferral an Cybermurders your account.
This is not something my people tell.
It is something i know myself
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utopiArte
in reply to utopiArte • — (tupambaé) •Standard view of an anonymous #poll voting on mastodon as seen from #friendica in comparison to the [now] existing #votingByName option on friendica.
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utopiArte
in reply to utopiArte • — (tupambaé) •"This proposal is the most awesome idea ever, and it didn't occur to me by any chance!"
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Wilhelm
in reply to utopiArte • • •Should be "poll" not pool?
I think having support for real polls is superior than abusing like / dislike for polls. Many polls cannot be answered with like / dislike. Thus I "vote" with dislike.
On the long run ideally like + dislike will be replaced by allowing arbitrary emoji reactions. And like + dislike are optional so many instances opt to disable dislike. And while I am a big fan of allowing any emoji, those instances also have good reasons to limit reactions.
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utopiArte
in reply to Wilhelm • •Sounds fascinating for me that you percive this as an "abuse" of like / dislike .
For me like/dislike is just +/-.
Actually on mastodon they press a fav and over here the software tells me that it's a like.
Never thought about that, or heard that option.
I guess it sounds plausible, would be like element works right now.
Personally I perceive the whole emoji movement as childish kitsch and prefer my gif quick comments here on f°.
Arbitrary emoji reactions could be added inbetween the existing +/-.
Users of those instances would have a handy cap like participants from mastodon or D* have.
It could or should be considered in the contextual text design of those pools.
Also that would made none friendicans like second class citizens with lesser or no voting right's, like not nationalized citizens that have the duty to pay taxes but are not allowed to the ballot boxes, I like that idea ..
thx (seriously) for pointing out my intent to drown poll's in a pool, my spell checker isn't LLM yet and I just trained him to accept the every existence of friendicans as a human race!
I liked that you raised a voice in the first place and helped me to improve my take and gave you a fav for that.
(reluctant trilingual [staatl Dipl Ing] legastenik over here)
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utopiArte
in reply to utopiArte • •the home team gladiator wrote:
quick comment line:
[img=https://tupambae.org/photo/899354870265509439c9128836443124-0.gif]diabolicLaugh[/img]👍 if you are in favor of the gladiator in the ring trying to defend his position of no need for pools on f^.
👍👎 if you ran desperatly to your quick comment tool to ad:
👎 if you agree with the chellanger of the exposed view by this original post.
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Wilhelm
in reply to utopiArte • • •Thumbs up / down was never designed for polls so yes, abuse / misuse / unintended use of implementation is accurate.
Feature request for emoji reactions is https://github.com/friendica/friendica/issues/12805 It has been in the tracker for a long time.
The emoji ship has sailed, they are a de facto standard which will not go away, no matter your personal perception. They are in every messenger, signal, element and even modern xmpp clients support message reactions.
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utopiArte
in reply to Wilhelm • •Ultimately, to begin with, this is about communication, words, meaning and the meaning we create for them in a evolving (or devolving) process.
An evolutionary proces called culture.
As background for this statement of mine I'd like to pinPoint to this conversational snippet on YT on the topic.
Nobody denied that.
Thanks for pointing out, I thought I could change the world.
That's not the point about emoji's.
The problem is more likely that when ever you give mono sapiens a hammer, he/she/it thinks that every thing looks like a nail.
It's the when, where and how, like always in the use of tools.
This is my first line (of defense) in my quick comment addon:
👍 👆 have a look at this! 😇 😮 😞 🤔 😟 🤦♂️Also, the way we present and implement those tools encourages their use, and can convert every comment into a stupid egyption sign language, or a advanced chinese language sign for that matter.
A language that you first have to learn, get used too and even might missinterpretate.
:)
Thumbs up / down was never designed for polls so yes, abuse / misuse / unintended use of implementation is accurate.In my way of meaning this is conservativ BS
What is true, and worth while too point out, is that 👎👍 is the global international sign language since the roman empire, so in the first place I'd suppose that we should skip the words in all languages for the thumbs, if we haven't done already, and only leave the thumbs sign.
That way we skip the fb BS of friends and likes imposed by a criminal psycopath on the world of the 21first century.
By doing that, instead of arguing that some original intent and design is a wall that has to be respected as a rule cisceled into stone, we could give our minds the chance to think outside the box and evolve the design of our tool friendica, actually be a quite cool KISS move, opening the doors of our software wide open to become even capable of having a democratic feature used to make laws in most evolved democracies of the planet.
So, this time my dear freind @Wilhelm I liked your comment because the link to github is much apreciated. I guess that you frequent that site a lot.
You'd really do me a favor.As I don't any more, can you place the folling link as a comment in that githib request:
https://github.com/friendica/friendica/issues/12805
Comment:
(seriously)
👍
@all, please don't vote this comment, I already won.Game, set and match!
At least in my humble mind and the opninion I came to in that personal space by creating this post and evolving the idea, that includes the help of your feedBack.
The rest is CAKE
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Hypolite Petovan
in reply to utopiArte • • •Friendica Support reshared this.
utopiArte
in reply to Hypolite Petovan • •Could poll's be added by an addon @Hypolite Petovan ?
👍 if you, who ever you are, think so.
👍👎 if you don't know
👎 that's not possible or reasonable. If you dislike because it's not reasonable please add the reasoning to the comments bellow.
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Hypolite Petovan
in reply to utopiArte • • •@utopiArte No, because it requires additional database tables to record local users’ votes in polls. So it wouldn’t be easier to make it as an addon.
What needs to be done:
- Update the current poll display to include form controls for local users to vote.
- Update the current poll display to reflect the current user’s choice(s).
- Store the local users’ choices, currently we only store vote aggregates transmitted to us by the remote systems.
- Wire the form to the storage through an asynchronous module.
- Add a form to attach a poll to a post, maybe as an additional tab in the JOT?
- Store the user-created polls along with their options. This may be already available since we’re storing remote polls.
- Wire the form to the post creation in the already humongous Item module.
- Add support for polls in the ActivityPub post transmission.
- Add a fallback display for Diaspora which we still support.
The challenges:
- Currently polls are cached with the rest of the post body for all local users. Allowing individual users to vote and displaying their choice(s) invalidate this caching mechanism, so the poll display needs a special treatment, either synchronously with the associated page load performance hit, or asynchronously with a progressive enhancement of the poll display.
- The vote module must take into account the poll policies (expiration, number of allowed choices) and transmit votes to the remote system where the poll originated. If the poll originated on Friendica, it must transmit the updated vote aggregates to the post’s recipients.
As you can see, it isn’t trivial and it touches several internal features of Friendica.
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Wilhelm
in reply to Hypolite Petovan • • •like this
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utopiArte
in reply to Wilhelm • — (tupambaé) •Even tho the emoji conversation is offtopic:
Not out of the need for some kind of agreement or to meet in the middle, @Wilhelm but integrating the fact that emojis do exist and ar a nice tool and at the same time trying to prevent them spamming our content the following came up, looking at the emoji bar of the github link you posted.
Introducing the selection button, inbetween thumbs up and thumbs down allowing only one selection of emoji would create a new kind of combined basic expressions.
Two pictures, the first is all options off.
The second, one emoji was selected, in this case the heart emoji, and the thumbs up was selected.
Of course the negative thumb expression could have been selected insted, together with flames or crying or what ever.
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mʕ•ﻌ•ʔm jesuiSatire .. ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ
in reply to utopiArte • • •The idea as described and executed doesn't work for #diaspora contacts.
Post and answers to vote on, of course only with a favorable option, can't be modified in a second step because post's nor answers can be modified. The whole poll sequence would needed to be designed before hand, undergo enough revisions, so the poll is with out any doubt well written and understandable, and than posted in a short sequence.
Not really a problem at all, but a detail to have in mind.
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Erik R
in reply to utopiArte • • •I'd want a poll created on Friendica to be presented as a poll on other Fediverse platforms, especially since the downvote isn't available on all platforms (or even instances). This is not really possible with your suggestion. A free-form post is difficult to transform into a proper poll, which I assume needs be done in the background by the Friendica-to-ActivityPub connector.
Transforming a Friendica poll into a Mastodon poll (and vice versa) seems doable, if someone steps up to take on the task.
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mʕ•ﻌ•ʔm jesuiSatire .. ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ
in reply to utopiArte • • •Just waking up @Erik R, even the morning mate water hasn't steered up to the propper temperature, so this is more like a #toGetYourIdea comment and questionair.
Important detail first for D* users, the original post on friendica has already moved to v.0x so it's recommended to visite this link to have an idea if there have been importante updates, other wise yor comments might become out of context or be way behind the time line. Also, as you don't see eventual comments from other activityPub plattforms, this could be useful, if there were any. As of now only some troll attacs by the already known characters, so "there is nothing to see there to that regard, please walk on".
To begin with, and just for to explicitly clarify, you are commenting from D* and this profile is too.
Looks like this is also true for D* polls.
In other words what you are proposing is a poll request elaborated/discussed on friendica could be published from mastodon, and actually also on D*, to breach the gap?
And that for example viceversa mastodon profiles could request a vote by name poll, or a free-form post as you call it, from some samaritanian friendican?
Erik R
in reply to mʕ•ﻌ•ʔm jesuiSatire .. ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ • • •Yes, that's about it. I think polls have semantics that go beyond free-form-post-with-likes-and-dislikes. Therefore, I think a poll should be sent as a poll - and votes as votes - to the platforms that support that. (Didn't remember that D* has polls.)
Platforms that don't have polls should probably just be sent an ordinary post and be left out of the voting.
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utopiArte
in reply to Erik R • •There was just created a poll on D* to see if and how it federates to f^.
https://tupambae.org/display/0912be00c786013d5693625791e387e3
No integration of the result at all.
Actually there is some kind of, f^, we need to talk, what are we going to do with D*.
D*, we need to talk what are your plans in general terms?
(but that's offtopic here,
@allplease ignore!)thx for this one @Erik R.
Terms, agreeing on terms, creating meaning by talking about it, is a fundamental task.
👍
Your request is reasonable, interesting an most likely even doable just using the helpers forum and in any case some direct help request from diasporians to friendicans.
It even could be interesting to create a voting forum page.
Actually this community server has just put it on the #requestToDo list for consideration.
:)
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utopiArte
in reply to utopiArte • •mʕ•ﻌ•ʔm jesuiSatire .. ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ hat geschrieben:
What link mʕ•ﻌ•ʔm jesuiSatire .. ᘛ⁐̤ᕐᐷ?
Look's that there was definitely missing some #mateina in your circuits.
Here is the link to watch the whole thing unraveling in real time and with all eventual text updates in posts and answers, dear #diasporians:
https://forum.friendi.ca/display/0ac89072-1767-a1e2-3482-4df229573083
Actually such a link is federated thru out the activityPub federation but not present on D*, so friendicans could consider to add those originating links in a comment if that seems reasonable or important, probably something to have in mind depending on the content.
Right now the post is in v.02
Mayor changes:
* poll's aren't drown in pool's anymore
header hat geschrieben:
footer hat geschrieben:
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